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The Norfolk Broads Forum / Broads Authority Issues / Toll charges are reasonable
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Posted By Discussion Topic: Toll charges are reasonable

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Paladine
Oct-01-2017 @ 12:23 PM                           Permalink
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"I tried to appeal this charge to DtP under S.31 as should be my right, only to be told the procedure does not apply."

Did you actually send your objection to the DfT (rather than to the BA), and did the DfT tell you that the procedure didn't apply to adjacent water charges?

"..for the avoidance of any doubt, the broads are not legally a national park and do not come under the national park legislation, and nor will they."
Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for DEFRA (Hansard 2015)

TerryTibbs
Oct-01-2017 @ 4:37 PM                           Permalink
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I was under the impression that if a vessel was under repair by a Marine facilty that it did not need to be tolled or at least that is what I was told by the B.A. Earlier this year I couldn't Toll my boat because the BSS had run out. When inspected the BSS inspector said that as the fuel tank on my boat was soldered not welded (as it had been from new) it would have to be removed and changed (this is despite the fact that it has passed it's BSS several times in the past), after some discussion it was agreed that if a fire suppresion system was fitted in the engine compartment that it would then comply with the BSS conditions. The system the yard recommended was on back order of 6-8 weeks,I was concerned that as my boat wasn't tolled I would be liable to prosecution so rang the B.A. And the advice I was given was that if it was in for repair I was ok without a Toll but if I wanted to use it I must buy a visitors Toll where I didn't need to have a BSS.

Dave

Je suis Charlie

Paladine
Oct-01-2017 @ 4:52 PM                           Permalink
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From the Broads Authority's web site:

"Q. My boat is currently moored in an “adjacent waters” but has been  out of commission for some time whilst I am carrying out repairs and restoration to it and does not seem to be covered by any of the other exemptions, will I have comply with the requirements?

A.You may be able to apply for an exemption for the requirement to pay a toll but not from the other requirements. You will need to apply in writing for the exemption.
  
The exemption will only apply to vessels which are moored in adjacent waters and which are not in use for navigation, residential or commercial purposes, and are moored in order to be serviced, repaired, or restored. The exemption will cease to apply once the vessel is used for any of those purposes.  It will apply only to boats in respect of which the owner self declares it will be out of commission for at least six months from the date of the application and for a maximum of one toll period.
  
This exemption will also not give rise to a repayment in respect of tolls already paid.

Any exemptions granted would be subject to random checking by the Authority to ensure any such vessels do not pose a hazard to third parties."


"..for the avoidance of any doubt, the broads are not legally a national park and do not come under the national park legislation, and nor will they."
Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for DEFRA (Hansard 2015)


This message was edited by Paladine on Oct-1-17 @ 4:54 PM

MarWak
Oct-01-2017 @ 5:56 PM                           Permalink
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Daz , Marshman  Firstly, I do have a boat here, presently out of the water. I've owned very many in the past and hopefully will again.

I go 'bleating-on' about it because it is, in my view a serious matter of public injustice, cynically perpetuated by an organisation with very wide powers and very little accountability in its own interests. Yes, that is a matter of opinion but I think I'm quite well qualified to hold it: I've thirty years experience as a professional harbour master in harbours all round UK (including the Broads) and I am a fully qualified solicitor with harbour law experience. Further, what I am mainly bleating on about is the fact that BA have prevented me from exercising my right to have this matter heard by the proper body, which is DtP Ports Division. How do I know this? Because it was DtP who told me that the toll was made under Broads Act, not Harbours Act and therefore S.31 did not apply to my case, when I tried to exercise that right to appeal, as I always advised people to do if they complained about their toll when I worked at BA.
I have challenged BA why they are unwilling to expose their toll to the same scrutiny as all other UK harbour charges. I have undertaken to abide by DtP's decision. Why won't they do likewise?
This may seem like a storm in a teacup, but it is on just this sort of apathy that fascists and dictators flourish!

daz3210
Oct-01-2017 @ 6:40 PM                           Permalink
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You are confusing me now.

You say the DtP has said s31 does not apply to Broads Tolls, and you say you will abide by that decision???? But then you seem to say you think a s31 appeal should be heard?????

The you say the BA are not respecting the decision that s31 does not apply... surely they are by not taking any part in such an appeal.......

Please explain further where the BA are wrong re s31......


Wocka Wocka Wocka

Paladine
Oct-01-2017 @ 6:47 PM                           Permalink
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"Further, what I am mainly bleating on about is the fact that BA have prevented me from exercising my right to have this matter heard by the proper body, which is DtP Ports Division. How do I know this? Because it was DtP who told me that the toll was made under Broads Act, not Harbours Act and therefore S.31 did not apply to my case, when I tried to exercise that right to appeal, as I always advised people to do if they complained about their toll when I worked at BA.
I have challenged BA why they are unwilling to expose their toll to the same scrutiny as all other UK harbour charges. I have undertaken to abide by DtP's decision."


The toll was made under the Broads Act, as that is the relevant legislation. The DfT Ports Division has told you that S.31 doesn't apply to your case, so you clearly have NOT abided by their decision. It seems to me that you are attacking the wrong foe.

It may well be that the law is an ass in this case, but the BA cannot act as a harbour authority in adjacent waters, so can hardly impose any harbour dues. Or is that just too simple a proposition.

"..for the avoidance of any doubt, the broads are not legally a national park and do not come under the national park legislation, and nor will they."
Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for DEFRA (Hansard 2015)

Paladine
Oct-01-2017 @ 6:49 PM                           Permalink
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daz3210, you beat me to it again.

"..for the avoidance of any doubt, the broads are not legally a national park and do not come under the national park legislation, and nor will they."
Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for DEFRA (Hansard 2015)

Marshman
Oct-01-2017 @ 7:38 PM                           Permalink
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And now, I have spotted who Marwak is!!! Not that that really alters the situation I have to say but it does raise the question as to whether there is a hidden agenda behind all of this.

I would suggest that he now goes off and pursues his claim through the Courts and ultimately as a result we may see who is right. That is if he choses to abide by their decision - shame in a way that he chooses to attack the Authority over an issue so many are seemingly unmoved by!

But he will do so without I suspect, without the support of those to whom he appealed to back his cause.

Harlequin
Oct-01-2017 @ 10:21 PM                           Permalink
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" And now, I have spotted who Marwak is!!!"

A bit slow on the uptake for once MM. Smile

TerryTibbs
Oct-01-2017 @ 12:33 AM                           Permalink
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Axes and grinding comes to mind.

Dave

Je suis Charlie

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